Camel overloaded with flax that knocks over a Chanukah candle of a store owner...
What is the law if the store owner placed the Chanukah candles inside?
What is the law if the store owner placed the Chanukah candles outside his store?
What is the reason for either case?
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The Channukah candle could have been put in a window...
It is the camel owner's problem because it was his fault that the camel spilled the flax.
If they are Chanukah candles, the storeowner is exempt from paying for the damages.
If the candles were inside, then you were not completing the laws of publicising Hannukah!
you put it in a window and the camel has to pay if its inside but the owner of the store has to pay if its outside the reason for these is because its the owners responsibility if its outside of his property and visa versa
1)He has to put it by a window.
2)it must be far enough so the store won't catch on fire.
3)it should not make the store catch on fire!
the chanukah candle should be higher than the camel wagon thing or ten amot (fists)
Chanukah Inside store: camel owner pays
Chanukah Outside store: camel owner
Reason-He was trying to publicize the Mitzvah so the camel owner destroyed a Mitzvah
If they are Chanukah candles, then the store owner is exempt because he was just fulfilling the mitzvah. If the candles were placed inside, then it is the camel owner's fault because the camel was the one that got the flax in the store.
The reason for all these cases is that you should publicize the miracle of chanukah.
If the candle are inside of the store then the camel owner must pay, but if the candle is outside in a public property then the store owner must pay for the damages. The reason for this case is to figure out who would pay if this incident occurs.
A reason for having the candles inside is that there may not be windows or they may be tinted...
If the candle is inside the shop, then it is the camel owners fault. His flax rolled into the store. If the candle was outside, the store owner pays. This is because the camel might have stumbled and lit the candle. This is the negligence of the store owner for leaving a flammable object outside.
If its inside the store owner the camal owner has to pay for the damages
If its outside the store owner the camal owner has to pay for the damages
The reason for the 2nd one is b/c sum1 is obligated to publisize the miracle the best they can and its hard to c from inside the store
If the candles were inside it was the camel owners fault but if it was outside it was the store owners fault
if they were inside, he is exempt because they are the chanukah candles. if they were outside, it is the camel owner's fault.
the reason is b/c we need to publicize the miracle of hanukkah
If the store owner places the candle inside it is not his fault because it was not placed in a place easy to knock down. He is responsible because there are carriage that often pass through the streets and the candle was placed in a vulnerable place. The reason for this case is so we can apply cases similar to it and use the laws that apply to it.
Chanukiah Inside store: camel owner pays
Chanukiah Outside store: camel owner
Reason-He was trying to publicize the Mitzvah so the camel owner destroyed a Mitzvah
The law if the candle is inside is the camel owners fult because the store owner was being responsible. If its on pulic land its the store owners fault, and if they are right out store no ones fault because its channukah candles.
You have to put it in the window. If it is outside you have to put it in a visible but safe place. It should be higher then 10 fists. This is because it has to be in a safe place. If it is inside then it would be the owner of the stores fault but if it is outside it is the camel owners fault
If it is such a problem, don't have a Chanukiah OR candles...problem solved.
Leah,
The hannukah candles were supposed to be in a window or publicized somehow. so if the candles were inside, then he was not doing as he was supposed to. it doesnt mean he is obligated, but he is not fulfilling a mitzzvah.
If the store owner put the candle inside his store it is the camel owners fault because he is responsible for the camel, but if the store owner put it outside than it is his fault because his is putting it in a public place which he doesn't own it.
If the candles were outside then it would be the store owner's fault. If the candles were in a window then the camel's owner would be at fault! The reason for the candles in the first place was to publicize the miracle of Hanukkah.
Lauren,
you have to have chanukkah!!!!!
Zane- but it's not the camel's fault that he messed up the mitzvah, what if he was just not paying attention. Like the other instance we talked about with the baby!
JILE, LEAH ( woops caps) and zane and kinda nadine.. r wrong
michael Llor is the rite 1
Chanukiah Inside store: camel owner pays
Chanukiah Outside store: camel owner
This reasoning makes a lot of sense.
haha michael.
blog
Sarah Q - what if someone doesnt care about it or they're not Jewish?
people should put it in a glass case so nothing catches on fire but the glss
Lauren, Then the law doesn't aplly to them. . . this is about a jewish store owner of course they celebrate chanukah!!!!!!!!!!!!!
leah- Zane says it isn't the camel's fault but it is the camel's owner for not controlling the animal, and that is resolving memrah said by Zane Hellmann
What if the glass case is too expensive michael?
sarah q - well maybe they don't care about it, and if they do then why can't they just put it in a window? If the window is tinted or if its a hassle or whatever then just don't have a chanukiah or have one at home or something. why is it so important to put one in a store anyway?
Leah meant that what Zane said was right because that's what Leah meant to begin with.
lauren- what if the store and their house is the same place????? huh? huh?!?!?!?!?
Ravina (yes the one that helped Rav Ashi compile the Mishnah) learns the reason for the store owner being exempt if it was placed outside is because we don't want to burden someone with fulfilling the law of Persumei Nisah.- Attack me...
sarah q - WHO LIVES IN THEIR STORE?? and if they do then they are obviously poor and wouldnt be able to afford a chanukiah OR candles....huh??? huh????? HUH??????????
Rabbi Karp,
Where did Ravina learn that from?
But publicizing the miracle is a law so a Mitzvah shouldn't be a burden to us because it is something that we should want to do-we should wasn't to listen to HaShem
oh ravina is definetly wrong
b/c its not a burden to put it anywhedre. it takes like 2 sec.
lauren- this law/talmudness was written a long time ago back then it was normal
Rabbi Karp- so even if the whole city burns down and everything is destroyed is because of the candles outside, and the store owner is exempt?
If it is a burden that it would actually be a better mitzvah because you spend more time on it.
sarah q - well fine then....i <3 you!
Julie, Ravina learnt that from the fact that the person could have lit his candles higher than 10 feet which would have prevented the flax from catching fire. The Rabbis dont want to burden him to climb that high.
But if they do not burden him, then it is just like asking him to even light the candles is burdening him...
Very good question Leah! I will look into it for you.
hey
Chanukah Inside store: camel owner pays
Chanukah Outside store: camel owner
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